The Potential Impact Of A Majority Of American Women Being Fat Has On Relationships...
The other day while looking for something else on the Internet, I ran accross the very alarming study:
http://obesity1.tempdomainname.com/subs/fastfacts/obesity_women.shtml
It clearly notes the fact that some 62% of ALL American women in our time are either overweight or obese-and growing. To what do we attribute this astrologically?
Well, several things: the chart of the United States of America itself, born on Jul 4 1776 at 5.10PM LMT in Philadelphia PA (12 Sag 19 Placidus); and the movements of Jupiter and Saturn, the Planets of Weight Gain and Weight Loss, respectively.
Let's consider these one at a time.
In the chart of the USA, we can clearly see that the females of the nation would have struggles with their weight as time wore on. Venus, one of the Female Planets, also a Benefic and "Fat" Planet, is in the Watery Sign of Cancer, a Sign known for its "roundness". It conjuncts Jupiter, exalted in Cancer, and hugely (pardon the pun) important here, for it also happens to be the largest planet in the Solar System and hence our astrology; it only makes sense that it would represent weight gain, "bigness" and the like.
Jupiter rules the Sagittarius Asc, suggesting that being big is a central feature of being American, and would become at some point a central focus for the nation to face.
We can note that Saturn is highly elevated and exalted in this chart but as it doesn't make any aspects to the Female Planets in the USA chart, (though it does square the Cancerian Sun, the Men) it doesn't play a role in slimming American women down. Only Jupiter is involved.
One could speculate that everytime Jupiter passes in its transit through the Sign of Cancer, which happens about every 12 years or so, that an upsurge of weight gain occurs among the American female population.
According to another article on AOL.com, the average American dress size was an 8, which would be comparable to a dress size 12 today, in the year 1955
(By the way, the average dress size of the American woman today in 2008: 14, officially Plus-Size). This the purported dress size of sex symbol and actress Marilyn Monroe.
At the time, looking in the ephemeris, Jupiter was in Cancer-Bingo!-while Saturn was in Scorpio, and while I'm here let me address this point:
That we can easily see the cycles of weight gain/loss by how Jupiter and Saturn "behave" in terms of the Signs in which they are placed at any given time. Depending on the nature of the Sign(s), we can determine who will win out, Jupiter (weight gain) or Saturn (weight loss). Jupiter's exaltation in Cancer clearly trumps Saturn's "lowly" status in Scorpio, so we can see who had the upper hand back in the day.
12 years on from 1955 is 1967; at the time, transit Jupiter was again in Cancer, and Saturn was in Aries, its Sign of Fall. It would be interesting to see if at this time American on average gained weight or not.
Add another 12 years to 1967 or so, and we get 1979; Jupiter in Cancer, Saturn in Virgo. Now, actually, we would have to back up a year or two, as Jupiter was just finishing up its transit of Cancer in 79, and was in its heyday in the Fall of 77 and much of 78. In these years, Saturn was in its Detriment in Leo, meaning that again Jupiter wins out (and thus, perhaps another jump in the average weight of the American female?), but Saturn was solidy in Virgo thirty years ago. In Virgo, Saturn is a sub ruler, as it rules the 2nd 10 degrees of that Sign. So, as Jupiter was leaving Cancer, Saturn was coming on to tighten the belt, so to speak.
Another 12 years to 1979, and we arrive at 1991; Jupiter was moving thru Cancer one year before, in 1990. Now, this is interesting, as Saturn was moving though its own Sign, Capricorn. It would be very interesting to see if the female population actually gained or lost weight during this time.
And that brings us to 2002, when that was the most recent Jupiter in Cancer transit, and while Saturn was passing thru Gemini. Clearly, Jupiter wins out again.
Hmm. Very interesting!
I've found that these two planets, Jupiter and Saturn, can even give strong clues as to whether a person, and here we're talking about women, is likely to weight gain problems or not, based on how these two planets are placed in the chart.
For example, take Oprah Winfrey, whose struggles with weight have become part of her saga: Jan 29 1954 4.30AM Kosciusko MS 29 Sag 41 Placidus Rodden. In her chart, Jupiter, which is the Asc ruler, is also the ruler of her Moon Sign Sagittarius, an is placed in the 6 house of diet, in the Sign of junk food Gemini, and Rx, denoting a fundamental weakness on her part to keep her weight under control, a matter of mind over body. Saturn is in the 10 no doubt, but in Scorpio, has no real standing by Sign, despite its square to both the Sun and Venus in O's chart.
Then there's the saga of Emmy Award winning actress Kirstie Alley, born Jan 12 1951 in Wichita KS, but at present no time is known. I've tried my hand at a trial rectification of her chart which yields an early birthtime of 5.40AM CST and gives an Asc of 20 Sag 25, making Jupiter in Pisces the Asc ruler, and as well, the dispositor of the Piscean Moon as well.
According to Wikipedia, Alley got as high as 400lbs in weight before joining a weight loss program with Jenny Craig in the year 2005; one year later, she appeared on Oprah to talk about her weight struggles. She claimed to be down to 175lbs at 5'7" tall. However, Rosie O'Donnell, at the time a co-hostess of The View, had openly questioned Alley's weight loss claims, by picking a woman of the stated size Alley mentioned, and had her come up to the stage. Both the woman and O'Donnell agreed that Alley couldn't be the same size, implying that Alley was lying.
Water Signs in general definitely speak to a tendency toward weight gain, as does Jupiter, especially when in his Dignity or Exaltation, and/or in aspect to the Angles or Lights. Rulership of the same may be important as well.
Going back to Alley and the disputed weight loss, for the time period 2005-06, we can see again that Jupiter would have finished up its transit of Cancer only a few years before, in 2002; Saturn would not have been strong enough by Sign to counterbalance Jupiter's effects. Saturn's weakness continued from 2003 to 2006, the years when it was transiting Cancer and Leo, Signs of Saturn's Detriment. Meanwhile, while it was true that Jupiter was passing thru its Detriment in Virgo, it gained favor in Libra, where it moved thru the Sign owned by fellow Benefic Venus. And, of course, in Scorpio, Jupiter finds a friend, due to its exaltation in the 3rd decan of the Sign, and its rulership of the 2nd.
If we consider the last time Jupiter transited Cancer, we will note that it opposed Alley's Sun in the Asc (body) in Jun of 2002, and when Jupiter passed thru Libra, it squared her Sun in Sep 2005, right around the time of her being reported to be 400lbs.
On the basis of these and other factors per my test time chart for Alley, it doesn't look likely that she did indeed take off as much weight as she had said on Oprah.
Oh, going back to Marilyn Monroe, born Jun 1 1926 9.30AM Los Angeles CA Placidus 13 Leo 04, Rodden, we see that Jupiter is widely conjunct the Moon both in Aquarius in the 7 house, angular, while Saturn is in the 4, also angular, but in Scorpio and Rx. Note also how Venus in Aries is sextile Jupiter. Hmm.
With a multi-year Recession looming ahead, punctuated by the thrice occuring "heavy" aspect movements of the Outer Planets involving Saturn, the planet of Recessions and Crashes in the Markets, perhaps now is the best time for the Ladies of the Nation to buckle down and trim the fat. Saturn in Virgo is an excellent time to do so, emphasizing efficiency and proper routines, making changes in diet and taking practical measures to ensure good health. But it perhaps won't be until Saturn by transit moves into Libra, late 2009-early 2010, that American women will get really serious about slimming down, as the Ringed Planet squares the USA Venus and Jupiter. Perhaps Vanity will win out over Health concerns to do the trick-Venus and Jupiter are in the 7 house of marriage and relationships afterall-and American men are NOT happy about this state of affairs.
Hmm...
Holla back
Salaam
Mu
http://obesity1.tempdomainname.com/subs/fastfacts/obesity_women.shtml
It clearly notes the fact that some 62% of ALL American women in our time are either overweight or obese-and growing. To what do we attribute this astrologically?
Well, several things: the chart of the United States of America itself, born on Jul 4 1776 at 5.10PM LMT in Philadelphia PA (12 Sag 19 Placidus); and the movements of Jupiter and Saturn, the Planets of Weight Gain and Weight Loss, respectively.
Let's consider these one at a time.
In the chart of the USA, we can clearly see that the females of the nation would have struggles with their weight as time wore on. Venus, one of the Female Planets, also a Benefic and "Fat" Planet, is in the Watery Sign of Cancer, a Sign known for its "roundness". It conjuncts Jupiter, exalted in Cancer, and hugely (pardon the pun) important here, for it also happens to be the largest planet in the Solar System and hence our astrology; it only makes sense that it would represent weight gain, "bigness" and the like.
Jupiter rules the Sagittarius Asc, suggesting that being big is a central feature of being American, and would become at some point a central focus for the nation to face.
We can note that Saturn is highly elevated and exalted in this chart but as it doesn't make any aspects to the Female Planets in the USA chart, (though it does square the Cancerian Sun, the Men) it doesn't play a role in slimming American women down. Only Jupiter is involved.
One could speculate that everytime Jupiter passes in its transit through the Sign of Cancer, which happens about every 12 years or so, that an upsurge of weight gain occurs among the American female population.
According to another article on AOL.com, the average American dress size was an 8, which would be comparable to a dress size 12 today, in the year 1955
(By the way, the average dress size of the American woman today in 2008: 14, officially Plus-Size). This the purported dress size of sex symbol and actress Marilyn Monroe.
At the time, looking in the ephemeris, Jupiter was in Cancer-Bingo!-while Saturn was in Scorpio, and while I'm here let me address this point:
That we can easily see the cycles of weight gain/loss by how Jupiter and Saturn "behave" in terms of the Signs in which they are placed at any given time. Depending on the nature of the Sign(s), we can determine who will win out, Jupiter (weight gain) or Saturn (weight loss). Jupiter's exaltation in Cancer clearly trumps Saturn's "lowly" status in Scorpio, so we can see who had the upper hand back in the day.
12 years on from 1955 is 1967; at the time, transit Jupiter was again in Cancer, and Saturn was in Aries, its Sign of Fall. It would be interesting to see if at this time American on average gained weight or not.
Add another 12 years to 1967 or so, and we get 1979; Jupiter in Cancer, Saturn in Virgo. Now, actually, we would have to back up a year or two, as Jupiter was just finishing up its transit of Cancer in 79, and was in its heyday in the Fall of 77 and much of 78. In these years, Saturn was in its Detriment in Leo, meaning that again Jupiter wins out (and thus, perhaps another jump in the average weight of the American female?), but Saturn was solidy in Virgo thirty years ago. In Virgo, Saturn is a sub ruler, as it rules the 2nd 10 degrees of that Sign. So, as Jupiter was leaving Cancer, Saturn was coming on to tighten the belt, so to speak.
Another 12 years to 1979, and we arrive at 1991; Jupiter was moving thru Cancer one year before, in 1990. Now, this is interesting, as Saturn was moving though its own Sign, Capricorn. It would be very interesting to see if the female population actually gained or lost weight during this time.
And that brings us to 2002, when that was the most recent Jupiter in Cancer transit, and while Saturn was passing thru Gemini. Clearly, Jupiter wins out again.
Hmm. Very interesting!
I've found that these two planets, Jupiter and Saturn, can even give strong clues as to whether a person, and here we're talking about women, is likely to weight gain problems or not, based on how these two planets are placed in the chart.
For example, take Oprah Winfrey, whose struggles with weight have become part of her saga: Jan 29 1954 4.30AM Kosciusko MS 29 Sag 41 Placidus Rodden. In her chart, Jupiter, which is the Asc ruler, is also the ruler of her Moon Sign Sagittarius, an is placed in the 6 house of diet, in the Sign of junk food Gemini, and Rx, denoting a fundamental weakness on her part to keep her weight under control, a matter of mind over body. Saturn is in the 10 no doubt, but in Scorpio, has no real standing by Sign, despite its square to both the Sun and Venus in O's chart.
Then there's the saga of Emmy Award winning actress Kirstie Alley, born Jan 12 1951 in Wichita KS, but at present no time is known. I've tried my hand at a trial rectification of her chart which yields an early birthtime of 5.40AM CST and gives an Asc of 20 Sag 25, making Jupiter in Pisces the Asc ruler, and as well, the dispositor of the Piscean Moon as well.
According to Wikipedia, Alley got as high as 400lbs in weight before joining a weight loss program with Jenny Craig in the year 2005; one year later, she appeared on Oprah to talk about her weight struggles. She claimed to be down to 175lbs at 5'7" tall. However, Rosie O'Donnell, at the time a co-hostess of The View, had openly questioned Alley's weight loss claims, by picking a woman of the stated size Alley mentioned, and had her come up to the stage. Both the woman and O'Donnell agreed that Alley couldn't be the same size, implying that Alley was lying.
Water Signs in general definitely speak to a tendency toward weight gain, as does Jupiter, especially when in his Dignity or Exaltation, and/or in aspect to the Angles or Lights. Rulership of the same may be important as well.
Going back to Alley and the disputed weight loss, for the time period 2005-06, we can see again that Jupiter would have finished up its transit of Cancer only a few years before, in 2002; Saturn would not have been strong enough by Sign to counterbalance Jupiter's effects. Saturn's weakness continued from 2003 to 2006, the years when it was transiting Cancer and Leo, Signs of Saturn's Detriment. Meanwhile, while it was true that Jupiter was passing thru its Detriment in Virgo, it gained favor in Libra, where it moved thru the Sign owned by fellow Benefic Venus. And, of course, in Scorpio, Jupiter finds a friend, due to its exaltation in the 3rd decan of the Sign, and its rulership of the 2nd.
If we consider the last time Jupiter transited Cancer, we will note that it opposed Alley's Sun in the Asc (body) in Jun of 2002, and when Jupiter passed thru Libra, it squared her Sun in Sep 2005, right around the time of her being reported to be 400lbs.
On the basis of these and other factors per my test time chart for Alley, it doesn't look likely that she did indeed take off as much weight as she had said on Oprah.
Oh, going back to Marilyn Monroe, born Jun 1 1926 9.30AM Los Angeles CA Placidus 13 Leo 04, Rodden, we see that Jupiter is widely conjunct the Moon both in Aquarius in the 7 house, angular, while Saturn is in the 4, also angular, but in Scorpio and Rx. Note also how Venus in Aries is sextile Jupiter. Hmm.
With a multi-year Recession looming ahead, punctuated by the thrice occuring "heavy" aspect movements of the Outer Planets involving Saturn, the planet of Recessions and Crashes in the Markets, perhaps now is the best time for the Ladies of the Nation to buckle down and trim the fat. Saturn in Virgo is an excellent time to do so, emphasizing efficiency and proper routines, making changes in diet and taking practical measures to ensure good health. But it perhaps won't be until Saturn by transit moves into Libra, late 2009-early 2010, that American women will get really serious about slimming down, as the Ringed Planet squares the USA Venus and Jupiter. Perhaps Vanity will win out over Health concerns to do the trick-Venus and Jupiter are in the 7 house of marriage and relationships afterall-and American men are NOT happy about this state of affairs.
Hmm...
Holla back
Salaam
Mu
Replies are closed for this discussion.
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Natasha on -
Stillness, plus ScorpioNights... That's pretty good man. xD
Let's compare American men and the ones from Asia! XD Yesh that means my uncles and pop. (But also teachers students ect.)
Course there's one of every in each culture, like all those traits in a non-American too. But like you said, just many, not all.
I seriously know mostly skinny American guys though... but yeah, not the point. ^^; (Gosh darnit I'm not sticking up for anyone, I'm not. xD)
Hm, how bout my generation of American guys? What are they gonna turn into? O.o Some are on this end, others somewhere else... No end can really be greater than the other either, if you take in account individuals themselves. Like the intention is what? xD
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Permalink Reply by Natasha on
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with lower prospects due to lack of education and lower-paying jobs approach me with such entitlement.
Hm. That kinda feels like home to me though. XD If these are genuinely good guys. Then they wouldn't do that, they're just always nice for comfort. I assume by approach...well yeah, from that I get the insistence vibe, or something a little off. That just sucks.
Ergh never mind. xP
Erm, but also there's also the mindset that you can get much for little, which has been done. I've seen it o course. xD That kind of living is very iffy tho. And to me this does to tie into what we're saying... so there. xP
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Permalink Reply by Mu'Min on -
I knew it wouldn't be long before the woefully astrologically inept Hatahs of a Feminist Stripe would come in. Pull up a chair.
First, the facts: do you dispute them as presented? If so, can you present countervailing stats, please?
Second, the astrology: I have presented several key examples plus theory to address what is occuring in realtime. If either of you ladies disagree, perhaps you could present some better astrology?
Now, lets get to the good part. Most men around the world consider American Women to not only to be the fattest, but also the mosy unfeminine, on average. There is no great Migration of Foreign Men coming to American Shores to ask for any American Woman's hand in Marriage or much else.
As an African American Man, I can tell either of you that there isn't much of a Run on Sistas either in the IR dating and especially Marriage Market. At present Black Male/White Female marriages eclipse the reverse easily 3 to 1, and have for more than three decades. Asian Men are indeed the most educated, but the deemed the least desirable by both White and Black American Women.
Oh, and Men by and large, pardon the pun, couldn't care less what school a oman has gone to. They care about her Beauty, personality, and loyalty, among other things.
Now, if either of you actually have something of merit to contribute to the dicussion, I'm all ears...
Comments-informed, this time, please?
Salaam
Mu
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Permalink Reply by ScorpioNights on -
Lame.
The rest of us will be here in the 21st century when you're ready to join us.
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Permalink Reply by Natasha on
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You know what this reminds me of?
A messed up survey I read a couple days ago! xD
It had the averages of how people rated the likeliness of certain couples... You know I was laughing over that, especially because it had a little side info too. So who's attractive to who? (Yeah this has nothing to do with this... just saying I had a good lunch over that.)
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Permalink Reply by Mu'Min on
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And one other thing: no, I will NOT be doing a "hit" piece on Men, as this is NOT a "hit piece. Keep in mind please, that I ran accross the article on which this discussion is based BY ACCIDENT while looking for something else. And it is a highly legitimate issue of concern, so much so, that one would think that the umpteen feminist orgs, blogs and lobbies would have said something about it by now. I am endeavoring to determine what if any effects this widespread, pardon the pun, trend will have on "love and relationships", and how any of this is seen in astrological terms. My own thinking is that its gotta effect it in a ahem, big way.
So again, if Stillness & Co. have anything pertinent to actually add to the discussion I welcome them to do so. If on the other hand, they only wish to harangue the messenger, they can see themselves to the Exit.
That is, if they can fit thru it?
Salaam
Mu
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Permalink Reply by Crabby Patty on -
The United States is overweight. It's a problem that crosses gender, race and age lines. We have more diabetics and people with cardiac disease than any other industrialized nation in the world. It all comes down to the food you eat and how much you intake. And Americans are known for eating large portions of shitty food. The problem is much deeper than American women being "hot" enough for relationships. It's a problem that is killing people every minute.
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Permalink Reply by Mu'Min on
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Stillness, no will make the mistake of actually thinking you know the difference between an astrolabe and an astrological chart. Again, my opening post has legitimate stats therein, backed up by legitimate astrological references. I have also offered a credible rectification of Alley's chart, in large part based on her weight problems, and, have offered a key timing technique wrt weight gain/loss. You have not actually debunked any of what I have said.
As this is a venue that focuses on the themes of love, sex and relationships, I thought it would be a good idea to explore this issue along these lines. Clearly, fr many American men, it IS an area of concern. And while it is true that American men are heavier these days, the average suit size has only gone up two sizes, from a 40 to a 44 over the past few decades. Hardly a "Big n Tall" by any stretch, and clearly not comparable to the average dress size of the American female, which is officially Plus.
So, there is no amount of twisting in the wind on this, Stillness. The realworld FACTS, plus the ASTROLOGY, are clearly on my side. Looks matter deeply to men in considerations of Amorous Matters. Period. Being Voluptupous is one thing. Simply being Vast, is another.
Seems like the Sisterhood's got some 'splainin' to do...
Holla back
Salaam
Mu
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Permalink Reply by Zamani on -
I dont think that any statistics showing an increase in Obesity among women is going to alter men's interest in dating some of these same women.
Despite the fact that men may harbor some idealistic fantasies about what they want physically, what they usually settle down with and marry is usually a completely different thing.
I think your trying to make a case for the idea that men will be 'rejecting" women for some reason in the future thats connected to their weight which is off the mark for the most part.
I know alot of women who are healthy and/or full figured and have no problems attracting men and descent, good looking ones at that. Certainly there might be men who prefer a slimmer women just as their are women who prefer men who are physically fit (which most men arent) or over 6 feet tall (which most men arent) etc. So with everything, it goes both ways.
I also don't buy the idea that men are any less obese than women are. Weight numbers in terms of POUNDS are very deceiving because.
1. Women have a naturally higher body fat percentage as well as carrying a larger amount of water weight due to estrogen and other hormones etc. 20 Percent body fat isnt high for a woman but is slightly higher for a man.
2. Also Mu, going up a suit size is a larger jump for a man in weight than a size or even three for a women based on their clothing etc.
3. Men have musculature than can disguise obesity.
As for the comments concerning looks and attraction, you would be seriously fooling yourself if you think that appearances aren't just as important to women, however women (because many of them are trying to connect to the complete person) often will overlook certain things, but I can tell you that most women (with the exception of some) universally are as opposed to dating guys who are short as much as some men might be turned off by a women being too plump.
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Permalink Reply by Natasha on
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Heh heh, I win for eating slowest. Mmmm. xD You can even make it a game sometimes. :3
However, during depressive times eating seems to be the response for moi. -nod nod- Also, when ya don't wanna eat the same stuff at home, you get something not even better outside.
Or skipping meals altogether and overeating in the next meal and therefore decreasing metabolic rates........ these are things Americans do.
I don't even have meals, it's the worst. Especially since what you are eating isn't even good. So that's the only thing that goes into your body, and thus... aksndf. No time no money, psh. xP
Gah, hate these muffins too ya know. Really I'd just rather not eat, but that's worse. >.>
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Permalink Reply by Natasha on
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"Be wary of the country that values work over food."
Seems countries that have people eat a lot, and a lot throughout the day...tend to have skinny people man. Not to say particularly healthy, but not fat. Although sure... they could be pretty healthy too. x3
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Permalink Reply by Mu'Min on
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This is very interesting.
The issue isn't whether Women do or do not like shorter men (and I can prove that a shorter man will have a MUCH easier time scoring a hot babe than a size 24 woman of the same height, Zam-Tom Cruise, anyone?), the issue isn't whether there are overweight men either, and the issue definitely ain't whether we should be having an "equal" discussion. We are discussing the very real potentials of women being overweight, grossly, can have on their dating prospects. Astrologers don't talk about things like this, which is in large part, pardon the pun, why I brought it up. Far too many astro-enthusiasts need a good whack on their head to bring them down to Earth. Things like this matter, ESPECIALLY to Men. Its even true, I'd argue, especially so, among Gay Men, who exercise excessively and put an uber focus on the Body Beautiful. By contrast, Lesbians tend to be the fattest women around.
So, unless a gal intends to go the "L" route, her appearance matters-and to Zam I would say, that he needs to go beyond the Black dating sites to those of the rest of the country, ie, White. There he will find that White men by and large, do not have the same appreciation Brothas do for a fuller figured form. So again, it matters.
So, having put forth the stats and the corroborating astrology, the question to my mind becomes...
If, in a consultation with such a lady-again, according to the stats is very likely-do you point this out to her? Or not? And why?
Comments?
Salaam
Mu
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